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JasonLEE
Level 5
Level 5
100 replies posted 250 sign-ins First like received

I designed the BLDC driver referring to the "EVAL-M1-IM828-A" development board, but it doesn't work.

I just don't know the cause.
The development board of the "EVAL-M1-IM828-A" allows the motor to function well. But I designed it the same way, but the motor doesn't work. The causes are as follows:

1. It seems that there is not enough power at the start of the motor. But I can't find the cause.

2. If a fault code is encountered, the hardware will fail due to the weak power of the entire hardware. I don't know the cause of this either.

3. All of these problems are hardware defects

3. I want to design a board that works well like EVAL-M1-IM828-A. I can attach my Schematic. Could you review my design?

Please reply.
Thank you.

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1 Solution
Akhil_B
Moderator
Moderator
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250 sign-ins First question asked 50 solutions authored

Hi @JasonLEE 

  • Two unnecessary resistors have been removed.
  • BandaruAkhil_0-1662958865948.png
  • Those are not unnecessary resistors. They will act as a discharge path for DC link capacitors. Good to have these resistors on the board.
  • Increased capacitance of the capacitor.
  • This will definitely help and also provides the peak currents.
  • But there's a problem. The reason is that the motor does not rotate much and the phrase "Gatekill" appears.
     In addition, I set the RPM of the motor to 500 and operated it, and the IPM increased to 100 ℃.
  • Gate kill appears if the overcurrent is detected and this overcurrent will raise the IPM temperature. Please check your currents.
  •  If the fault code pops up in the imotion and the LED flashes, the voltage of the entire PCB drops, and the PCB does not work. Which component should I use to improve this?
  • Please share the fault log and the waveforms. It helps in debugging.
  • I have attached the photos. If I place this component, will the problem I mentioned improve?Fig1. shows the DC link discharge resistors.Fig2. shows the +15V supply capacitors - These are present in the FNA23512A boardFig3. shows the Auxiliary power supply present in the Eval board.Let me know which boards you are testing. It is confusing. Please stick to one schematic and one common board or else it will be difficult to debug. Please share your final schematic. 

 

Best Regards,

Akhil Kumar.

 

View solution in original post

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17 Replies
psb
Moderator
Moderator
Moderator
250 sign-ins 25 solutions authored 100 replies posted

Hello @JasonLEE , 

  1.  Have you tested the system using the EVAL-M1-IM828-A as well ? Some of the reasons that the designed board might not be working are insufficient ratings of components, parasitic short circuits or lo resistance paths in the PCB or improper PCB design, discrepancies in the signal conditioning and feedback circuits.

  2. In the videos shared, what exactly are the test conditions that are being implemented ? And at what points of time is the board being turned off. 

  3. Kindly share the schematics and also different operating conditions of the board, so that we can evaluate and compare with EVAL-M1-IM828-A. 
Best Regards,
Sai
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JasonLEE
Level 5
Level 5
100 replies posted 250 sign-ins First like received

Hello @psb 

Thank you for your reply.

1. I tested using IM828XCC development board and it worked well.

2. I will send you a Schematic, so could you check which part has a problem?

3. If you enter a parameter value through the "MCE designer", the motor will not start at all. The power required for starting seems to be insufficient.

4. If the MCE has a fault code and the LED is blinking, the entire PCB will fail due to insufficient power in the entire PCB circuit.

5. The power switch reacts abnormally when the PCB is powered off.

6. I will attach the Schematic as a personal message.

Please send me a message.

IM828XCC.jpg

20220902_210635.png

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JasonLEE
Level 5
Level 5
100 replies posted 250 sign-ins First like received

Hello @psb 

I'm waiting for your reply.
When can I talk to you?

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Viswa
Moderator
Moderator
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10 likes received 50 solutions authored 100 replies posted

Hi @JasonLEE 

Our team will be happy to assist you,

We wanted to check if the schematics reviewed earlier and

the current one shared are for the same application or different.

 

We have not heard back from you after the earlier reply
https://community.infineon.com/t5/Motor-Control-ICs/I-modified-the-design-as-you-pointed-out/td-p/36...

 

Please confirm the application and if the schematics are for the same product.

 

Best Regards

 

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JasonLEE
Level 5
Level 5
100 replies posted 250 sign-ins First like received

Hello, @Viswa 

Thank you for your reply.

 

It changed the schematic before.
That schematic is fail.
Motor is not working.

if you want see the new schematic, You can send me in the message.

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Viswa
Moderator
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Moderator
10 likes received 50 solutions authored 100 replies posted

Hi @JasonLEE 

We have received the schematics sent to @psb , recently.

If there is any change from these also please send the new schematics.

Also please let us know the changes made from the earlier schematic revisions.

Best Regards,

 

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JasonLEE
Level 5
Level 5
100 replies posted 250 sign-ins First like received

Hello, @Viswa  

If you recived the new schematic from @psb , That is final design.

So you can check the schematic now do you have it?

I am hurry because I have many fail the design.

BestRegards

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Akhil_B
Moderator
Moderator
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250 sign-ins First question asked 50 solutions authored

Hi @JasonLEE 

Please find the below list of points.

Schematics observations in power board:

  • Compared to the Infineon schematic there is a change in DC link capacitors values. Is the sizing done according to your requirements?
  • There is a change in the Diode bridge rectifier. Is the sizing done accordingly?
  •  Auxiliary power supply (AE15-EW-S24) enough to drive the loads?
  • Why two IPMs are there on the power board?
  • What is the set threshold voltage level of DC bus sensing?
  •  Add sufficient capacitance to the +15V line (Vdd).

Testing Observations :

  • Is the source capable enough to supply the current? (because there is a change in the DC link capacitor value). This cause for high inrush current and the board will enter fault mode.
  • Once the Input supply is given, please check the +24V supply, +15V supply, hall sensor signals vs PWM’s, Itrip, Gate kill, and IU+ signals.

 

Best Regards,

Akhil Kumar.

 

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JasonLEE
Level 5
Level 5
100 replies posted 250 sign-ins First like received

Hello, @Akhil_B 

Thank you for your reply.

 

Schematics observations in power board:

1. There are two parts where the capacitor is placed Are you talking about the capacitor related to AE15-EW-S24 if it's DC Link?  Or are you talking about the capacitor in the DC bus part? Since the space of PCB is small, we arranged it considering the size and capacity as best we can.

2. Yes, the parts of the diode bridge rectifier are different, but I think there is no problem because the components I specified are higher specifications.

3. This component is not intended for load. This is a device for +24V output for external devices.

4. We have a multi-board format.
It is a type that integrates three PCBs, not one. You can understand if you look at the picture I attached. It's an inevitable choice because there's not enough space.

5. The reason why I have two drivers with IPM is that I can to choose to use one that works well.
But both types don't work.

6. DC BUS detected voltage is VDC600.

7. Yes, I will add more capacitors to the 15V line. However, we have placed capacitors with higher capacities than the reference design.

 

Testing Observations :

1. There are four capacitors in total.
Would it be okay to test after removing 2 of them?

2. Yes, I'll check and tell you.

I have an additional question.
The capacitor only has a slightly higher capacity, but is this part of the motor rotation affected?
Please reply.

 

 

Best Regards

Jason LEE

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Akhil_B
Moderator
Moderator
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250 sign-ins First question asked 50 solutions authored

Hi @JasonLEE 

1. There are two parts where the capacitor is placed Are you talking about the capacitor related to AE15-EW-S24 if it's DC Link?  Or are you talking about the capacitor in the DC bus part? Since the space of PCB is small, we arranged it considering the size and capacity as best we can.

I am referring to the DC link Capacitors.

2. This component is not intended for load. This is a device for +24V output for external devices.

Auxiliary supply means to drive the other circuits not the motor. Whether 24V with 0.625 A is sufficient for your application? Have you observed any voltage dip at 15 V supply ?

3. We have a multi-board format.
It is a type that integrates three PCBs, not one. You can understand if you look at the picture I attached. It's an inevitable choice because there's not enough space

Yes, I understood the three boards. one is the Power board, I-motion board and control board(Atmega).

4. There are four capacitors in total.
Would it be okay to test after removing 2 of them?

Try to replicate with the same capacitance and ripple current rating present in the Eval board(EVAL-M1-IM828-A).

 5.Yes, I'll check and tell you.

Share the signals and waveforms to debug.

6. Have you tested the EVAL-M1-101T with your power board(IM828)? 

7. Also please share your test conditions ?

 

Best Regards,

Akhil Kumar.

 

 

 

 

 

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JasonLEE
Level 5
Level 5
100 replies posted 250 sign-ins First like received

Hello @Akhil_B 

Thank  you for your reply

Yes, I will share the contents of the test after the test.

I have another question. Please advise how to set the capacitance of the capacitor in the 15V part.

What capacity should I use to make it suitable?

 

Best Regards

Jason LEE

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JasonLEE
Level 5
Level 5
100 replies posted 250 sign-ins First like received

Hello, @Akhil_B 

1. I tested it.

If you measure it after turning on the board,
+24V, +15V, +10V, +5V are all OK.

However, if a fault code occurs on the iMotion board,

+24V normal
+15V (falling to 5V)
+10V (falling to 5V)
+5V (falling to 3.5V)

I have this symptom.

 

2. Itrip, Gatekill, IU+ are normal.
If you look at the scope, the waveform is occurring and the VDC is flowing normally.

 

3. I measured the DC bus and found VDC600.
I set the parameter to VDC650.

 

4. Capacitors do not seem to have any problems.

I tried using it with lower capacity, but it didn't improve. Capacitors are only higher in capacity than development boards and do not seem to be the reason for the problem.

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JasonLEE
Level 5
Level 5
100 replies posted 250 sign-ins First like received

Error message.png

 The motor is not operating properly, but this message appears.

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Akhil_B
Moderator
Moderator
Moderator
250 sign-ins First question asked 50 solutions authored

Hi @JasonLEE 

1) Please share the +15V waveform across the VDD pin and GND of the IPM.

2) +15V power supply is dipping, this will happen if the supply is not capable to deliver the required current. Share the power supply sizing for the +15V net.

3) Remove the +15V LDO and repeat the same test by connecting a stiff DC power supply (provide the sufficient current limit) and share the waveforms. Also, share the current drawn by +15V supply. If the fault occurs share the fault log also.

 

Best Regards,

Akhil Kumar.

 

 

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JasonLEE
Level 5
Level 5
100 replies posted 250 sign-ins First like received

Hello @Akhil_B 

I succeeded in rotating the motor.

1. Two unnecessary resistors have been removed.
2. Increased capacitance of the capacitor.
3. The motor rotates.
4. But there's a problem. The reason is that the motor does not rotate much and the phrase "Gatekill" appears.
5. In addition, I set the RPM of the motor to 500 and operated it, and the IPM increased to 100 ℃.

6. If the fault code pops up in the imotion and the LED flashes, the voltage of the entire PCB drops and the PCB does not work. Which component should I use to improve this?
I have attached the photos. If I place this component, will the problem I mentioned improve?

 

Best Regards.

 

 

001.png

002.png

003.png

  

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Akhil_B
Moderator
Moderator
Moderator
250 sign-ins First question asked 50 solutions authored

Hi @JasonLEE 

  • Two unnecessary resistors have been removed.
  • BandaruAkhil_0-1662958865948.png
  • Those are not unnecessary resistors. They will act as a discharge path for DC link capacitors. Good to have these resistors on the board.
  • Increased capacitance of the capacitor.
  • This will definitely help and also provides the peak currents.
  • But there's a problem. The reason is that the motor does not rotate much and the phrase "Gatekill" appears.
     In addition, I set the RPM of the motor to 500 and operated it, and the IPM increased to 100 ℃.
  • Gate kill appears if the overcurrent is detected and this overcurrent will raise the IPM temperature. Please check your currents.
  •  If the fault code pops up in the imotion and the LED flashes, the voltage of the entire PCB drops, and the PCB does not work. Which component should I use to improve this?
  • Please share the fault log and the waveforms. It helps in debugging.
  • I have attached the photos. If I place this component, will the problem I mentioned improve?Fig1. shows the DC link discharge resistors.Fig2. shows the +15V supply capacitors - These are present in the FNA23512A boardFig3. shows the Auxiliary power supply present in the Eval board.Let me know which boards you are testing. It is confusing. Please stick to one schematic and one common board or else it will be difficult to debug. Please share your final schematic. 

 

Best Regards,

Akhil Kumar.

 

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Viswa
Moderator
Moderator
Moderator
10 likes received 50 solutions authored 100 replies posted

Hi @JasonLEE ,

 

We have not heard back from you. Please let us know if you have any further clarifications or if we can close the thread created.

 

Best Regards

 

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