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Motor Control ICs Forum Discussions

JasonLEE
Level 4
Level 4
First like received First solution authored 50 replies posted

Hello.


I designed a customized board using IMC101T-F064 and IM828XCC.

I faced two challenges.

1. This is the problem of the rise of high-speed RPM.
When the motor is loaded, it must operate up to Max RPM2500 rated RPM 2000 But it doesn't go up above 1000 rpm.

I read the data sheet to correct this and really tried to solve the problem, but it didn't improve.

Is there any way to solve this part?
Or is this system impossible to go up with high RPM?

 

2. As an alternative to question 1, I tried to change it to the hall sensor method.
But even this doesn't work.
I read the datasheet and tried to fix the problem, but it didn't work.
Only vibrations occur on both sides.

Can you solve this problem?
If you know the method, please share the method, not the data sheet.

It have error code "Hall invalid"

 

3. Data from the motor.

- Rated Current : 5A

- Inductance : 22.7mH

- Resistance : 3.8ohm

- Motor Pole : 10pole

- Hall sensor : three digital hall

-Back EMF : Ke=65

4. I haven't solved this problem for a month.
Anyone who can solve this problem, please answer.
Thank you.

 

motor waveform.bmp

1. Motor waveform

motor and hall waveform.bmp

2. U,V Waveform and HA,HB waveform.

 

20230102_171023.png

  

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1 Solution
RupakC
Moderator
Moderator
Moderator
First like given 50 solutions authored 100 replies posted

Hello @JasonLEE 
The motor rated current has been set to 5A but the motor reaches this current limit at much lower speeds when operated with load. This is the reason the speed does not increase any further. In such cases, the user may look into the following points:
1. Increase the current rating set in Q2 of MCE Wizard. Please note that this setting should be in accordance with the motor specifications. 
2. Activate the rotor lock fault protection (Q73 on MCE wizard). If this fault is triggered, it means that the PI controller for speed control has saturated. In this case, the user may adjust speed regulator PI gain and speed feedback filter time constant. Such a method is more suitable for problems related to speed acceleration or other similar problems during starting. 
3. Check if the input source has enough current sourcing capacity to supply the motor with rated current.
 
In this case, increasing the current rating set in Q2 of MCE helps to solve the problem.
Best Regards 

RupakC

View solution in original post

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24 Replies
RupakC
Moderator
Moderator
Moderator
First like given 50 solutions authored 100 replies posted

Hello @JasonLEE 

Some time back, we tried to solve some other issues you faced in the following thread: 

https://community.infineon.com/t5/Motor-Control-ICs/There-is-a-problem-with-my-design/m-p/369607#M15...

We suggested some changes/Modifications to your design in the earlier thread link. We would like to know if the hardware is the same. If same, can you please let us know if you have incorporated our suggestions. 

We see that there are multiple threads and case regarding your issues that are in progress. We request you to kindly close all the open threads and continue with resolving your present issues in this thread link. This will enable us to concentrate on your present problems. 

Please select one thread/case where you would like us to continue with solving your issues one by one. This will help us to track your progress in a more systematic way. 

Regards

RupakC
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JasonLEE
Level 4
Level 4
First like received First solution authored 50 replies posted

Hi @RupakC 

Thank you for your reply.

I closed the previous thread you mentioned.

Unlike previous hardware, we customized the hardware by referring to the EVAL-IM818XCC reference design.

The hardware is now working fine.

But I'm faced with the problem of not rising to high RPM.

There is nothing wrong with the motor parameters.
Up to RPM2500
Rated RPM2000.

However, it does not rise above 1000 RPM.
The motor is for HVAC.

There is no problem with the motor at all.
It rose to 3000 RPM when operated with other motor driver boards.

And the hall sensor is not activated.

I've used all the methods for a month, but there was no problem with the parameters.
I have no idea why.

 

Can you help me with this problem?

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Hi Jason LEE: Happy new year🤝

For your problem,  I think about they are from the setup can't meet your circuit. This is system question and nothing complicated. 

So my suggest is: Connect your sales or FAE. Most infineon system engineer and TM will focus on the service.

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@喜马拉雅之雪 

Hello.

Happy new year.

I tried and couldn't find the FAE.
It has been a long time since I made a technical inquiry to Infineon, but I have not received any reply.

I have invested a great deal of time and money to develop this circuit and firmware. Many things will go up in smoke if this circuit doesn't work.

 

I think the imotion system is hard to go up to high RPM.
There is a problem.

This system looks really problematic.
I think I wasted a lot of time.

 

 

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JasonLEE
Level 4
Level 4
First like received First solution authored 50 replies posted

Hi @喜马拉雅之雪

I don't understand.
No one seems to be able to handle this issue, even FAE engineers.

Is there no engineer in Infineon who can solve this problem?

 

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RupakC
Moderator
Moderator
Moderator
First like given 50 solutions authored 100 replies posted

Hello @JasonLEE 

I am in continuous contact with you over private message. Please share your latest board schematics and pcb design files. The drive link you have shared is locked. To solve your issue, I need to have details of your firmware entries and board schematics. Please share the required information over messages. 

Best Regards

RupakC
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Hi JasonLEE:

Don't worry. This is nothing complex for infinron engineer.

There are problem is from no better MCE setup. For exampe:

About Ke:

Your waveform is 180Vpk/18Hz(216rpm), so Ke=180/1.414/0.216=589V/krpm   your setup:65V/krpm

...

So we want check your setup by your test waveform, SCH and PCB layout.

Yesterday, I had send E-mail to your ceo address as you can't connect FAE, you said. But I am not see your reply, now.

For high speed, 2000rpm is very easy case. Lang ago, we had finished 150krpm by 101T.

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Hi @喜马拉雅之雪 

Thank you for your reply

You say 2000 RPM is an easy part of the problem, but you haven't come up with a proper solution.

I've tried all sorts of things for a month on this issue, but It doesn't show any signs of improving.

I don't think it's an easy problem at all.

I replied to the email when I received a call.

Please come up with a solution.

No one has come up with a solution to this problem.

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Hi: JasonLEE:

If your test waveform is right, Ke=589V.

For 3ph AC380V input, the DC BUS=380V*1.35=513V

If TD=3uS PWM=10kHz, the DC powerutilization ratio=94%

The output Vpk=513V*0.94=482V

So max speed is 482V*0.707/589V=579rpm

So if you want run to 2000rpm, you need use weakmagnetic function. But  the function depends on whether your motor can accept the weak magnetic current.

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Hello @喜马拉雅之雪 

I set it up the Ke value you said and nothing changes.

What is a weak magnetic current?

My motor used a different driver and operated at 2500 RPM under higher loads.

It's a motor that doesn't have any problems.

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Pleaese test motor current waveform in different speed. If your test is right, and motor speed is high than 580rpm, you can see weak-magnetic current.

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JasonLEE
Level 4
Level 4
First like received First solution authored 50 replies posted

Hello @喜马拉雅之雪 

Can't I send this motor and hardware to Infineon?
All the solutions you mentioned fail.
After setting it to this Ke value, the motor is very unstable.

Motor RPM only goes up to 450.

The motor keeps making the sound of trying to raise the RPM. But the RPM goes up and down and up and down.

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? Solution?  As I find that about some setup is not good and can't get other technical infor, so can't share solution.

Please connect  local infineon salse or FAE with the project.

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Are some settings not good?
I measured the exact parameters and started the motor.
The parameters were not wrong at all and I tested them all in many ways.

But the problem has not been solved at all.

You said it was a small problem, but you haven't found a problem either.

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RupakC
Moderator
Moderator
Moderator
First like given 50 solutions authored 100 replies posted

Hello @JasonLEE 

We are already in the process of resolving your issue. Please note that resolving your problem will take time and a solution cannot be immediately provided. Please be patient and let us help you to solve your issue. 

Regards

RupakC
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JasonLEE
Level 4
Level 4
First like received First solution authored 50 replies posted

Hi @RupakC 

OK......

Please help me solve this problem.

Can't you activate the hall sensor operation?
Even Digital Hall sensor operation is not activated.

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JasonLEE
Level 4
Level 4
First like received First solution authored 50 replies posted

Hi, @RupakC

This problem is not being solved at all.
I'm still walking in place.
When will we be able to resolve this problem?

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JasonLEE
Level 4
Level 4
First like received First solution authored 50 replies posted

Is there anyone?

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JasonLEE
Level 4
Level 4
First like received First solution authored 50 replies posted

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1s54NS7qVJNP8EUhq7yijBEPTZ5ApPZBx/view?usp=share_link

 

I attached a video of the waveform to this Google link, so please check it.

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Hello,

Try this profile.

 

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JasonLEE
Level 4
Level 4
First like received First solution authored 50 replies posted

Hi @User19250 

Oh, thank you very much.

I will try the parameters you provided. I sincerely hope that this parameter will be the solution.

I will tell you after testing this parameter.

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JasonLEE
Level 4
Level 4
First like received First solution authored 50 replies posted

Hi, @User19250 

Thank you very much for your help.
However, the parameters you provided do not operate the motor properly.
Therefore, it is not available.

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RupakC
Moderator
Moderator
Moderator
First like given 50 solutions authored 100 replies posted

Hello @JasonLEE 
The motor rated current has been set to 5A but the motor reaches this current limit at much lower speeds when operated with load. This is the reason the speed does not increase any further. In such cases, the user may look into the following points:
1. Increase the current rating set in Q2 of MCE Wizard. Please note that this setting should be in accordance with the motor specifications. 
2. Activate the rotor lock fault protection (Q73 on MCE wizard). If this fault is triggered, it means that the PI controller for speed control has saturated. In this case, the user may adjust speed regulator PI gain and speed feedback filter time constant. Such a method is more suitable for problems related to speed acceleration or other similar problems during starting. 
3. Check if the input source has enough current sourcing capacity to supply the motor with rated current.
 
In this case, increasing the current rating set in Q2 of MCE helps to solve the problem.
Best Regards 

RupakC
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JasonLEE
Level 4
Level 4
First like received First solution authored 50 replies posted

Hi, @RupakC  

I struggled with this problem for months, and I overcame it with you help. The sensorless approach achieved RPM to the target.

I will get hope and develop a second motor again.

Thank you very much.